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 Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010

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Monkey
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[17:53:50] Shitface : and so is tom
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PostSubject: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:23 pm

Name: Breloom

Diamond/Pearl/Platinum/Heart Gold/Soul Silver Sprite:
Black/White Sprite:
Back Sprite:
B/W Back Sprite:

Type: Grass/Fighting

Weak To:
  • Flying-x4
  • Poison-x2
  • Ice-x2
  • Fire-x2
  • Psychic-x2

Resist To:
  • Ground-x.5
  • Rock-x.5
  • Water-x.5
  • Electric-x.5
  • Grass-x.5
  • Dark-x.5


Moves:
By Level:
  • Start-Absorb
  • Start-Tackle
  • Start-Leech Seed
  • Start-Stun Spore
  • 5-Tackle
  • 9-Stun Spore
  • 13-Leech Seed
  • 17-Mega Drain
  • 21-Headbutt
  • 23-Mach Punch
  • 25-Counter
  • 29-Force Palm
  • 33-Sky Uppercut
  • 37-Mind Reader
  • 41-Seed Bomb
  • 45-Dynamic Punch

By TM/HM(Gen 4):
  • TM 01 Focus Punch
  • TM 06 Toxic
  • TM 08 Bulk Up
  • TM 09 Bullet Seed
  • TM 10 Hidden Power
  • TM 11 Sunny Day
  • TM 15 Hyper Beam
  • TM 17 Protect
  • TM 19 Giga Drain
  • TM 20 Safeguard
  • TM 21 Frustration
  • TM 22 SolarBeam
  • TM 23 Iron Tail
  • TM 27 Return
  • TM 31 Brick Break
  • TM 32 Double Team
  • TM 36 Sludge Bomb
  • TM 39 Rock Tomb
  • TM 42 Facade
  • TM 43 Secret Power
  • TM 44 Rest
  • TM 45 Attract
  • TM 49 Snatch
  • TM 52 Focus Blast
  • TM 53 Energy Ball
  • TM 56 Fling
  • TM 58 Endure
  • TM 60 Drain Punch
  • TM 68 Giga Impact
  • TM 70 Flash
  • TM 71 Stone Edge
  • TM 75 Swords Dance
  • TM 78 Captivate
  • TM 80 Rock Slide
  • TM 82 Sleep Talk
  • TM 83 Natural Gift
  • TM 86 Grass Knot
  • TM 87 Swagger
  • TM 90 Substitute
  • HM 01 Cut
  • HM 04 Strength
  • HM 06 Rock Smash

By TM/HM(Gen 5):
  • TM 06 Toxic
  • TM 08 Bulk Up
  • TM 09 Venom Shock
  • TM 10 Hidden Power
  • TM 11 Sunny Day
  • TM 15 Hyper Beam
  • TM 17 Protect
  • TM 20 Safeguard
  • TM 21 Frustration
  • TM 22 SolarBeam
  • TM 27 Return
  • TM 31 Brick Break
  • TM 32 Double Team
  • TM 36 Sludge Bomb
  • TM 39 Rock Tomb
  • TM 42 Facade
  • TM 44 Rest
  • TM 45 Attract
  • TM 47 Ankle Sweep
  • TM 48 Canon
  • TM 52 Focus Blast
  • TM 53 Energy Ball
  • TM 54 False Swipe
  • TM 56 Fling
  • TM 67 Retaliation
  • TM 68 Giga Impact
  • TM 70 Flash
  • TM 71 Stone Edge
  • TM 75 Swords Dance
  • TM 80 Rock Slide
  • TM 83 Cheer Up
  • TM 86 Grass Knot
  • TM 87 Swagger
  • TM 90 Substitute
  • TM 94 Rock Smash
  • HM 01 Cut
  • HM 04 Strength


By Breeding:
  • Charm
  • Fake Tears
  • False Swipe
  • Helping Hand
  • Seed Bomb
  • Wake-Up Slap
  • Worry Seed


Move Tutor:
In Platinum:
  • Fury Cutter
  • Helping Hand
  • Mud-Slap
  • Seed Bomb
  • Snore
  • Superpower
  • Synthesis
  • ThunderPunch
  • Vacuum Wave

In Heart Gold/Soul Silver:
  • Fury Cutter
  • Headbutt
  • Helping Hand
  • Mud-Slap
  • Seed Bomb
  • Snore
  • Superpower
  • Synthesis
  • ThunderPunch
  • Vacuum Wave
  • Worry Seed


Gender Ratio: Male: 50%; Feamle: 50%

Color: Green

Abilities: Effect Spore or Poison Heal
*DREAM WORLD* Technician

EV Yield: 2 Attack

Egg Type: Fairy and Plant

Evolution Tree: --lv. 23-->

Stats:

Stat BaseMin-MinMaxMax+
HP
60
-
261
324
-
Att.
130
266
296
359
394
Def.
80
176
196
259
284
Sp. A.
60
140
156
219
240
Sp. D.
60
140
156
219
240
Speed
70
158
176
239
262

Pokéthlon Stats:
Speed
3/3 ★★★
Power
4/5 ★★★★☆
Skill
2/5 ★★☆☆☆
Stamina
2/3 ★★☆
Jump
2/3 ★★☆
Total
13/19 ★★☆

Favorite Sets:
Monkey's Favorite Set:
Breloom-Adamant @Toxic Orb
*Poison Heal
-Spore
-Swords Dance
-Mach Punch
-Thunder Punch
EV's-4 HP, 252 Att., 252 Speed

Varment's 3 Favorite Sets:
1) "Classic SubPunch"
Adamant/Jolly @ Toxic Orb
40 HP/ 252 Atk/ 216 Speed (Jolly)
40 HP/ 216 Atk/ 252 Speed (Adamant)
~ Spore
~ Substitute
~ Seed Bomb
~ Focus Punch

2) "Choice Scarf"
Jolly @ Choice Scarf
4 HP/ 252 Atk/ 252 Speed
~ Spore
~ Seed Bomb
~ Stone Edge
~ Superpower

3) "SubPunch Variant"
Adamant @ Toxic Orb
12 HP/ 252 Atk/ 244 Speed
~ Spore
~ Stone Edge
~ Focus Punch
~ Substitute

Post anything else Breloom, or Breloom related. Any member who post their favorite set will set it listed here. Any member who needs an Breloom for their pokedex, PM Monkey.


Monkey

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Last edited by Champion Monkey on Sat Oct 02, 2010 3:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Sat Oct 02, 2010 2:36 am

What a great poke of the month, thats two in a row that I like! Heres a link to a smogon page dedicated to breloom. Its worth a read, especially for those who haven't really played with one before. Actually, reading this has gotten Breloom a spot on my last 7 teams and made it one of my favourite pokes of all time. You never have any idea how effective this guy can be until you've seen it for yourself.

Link ---> http://www.smogon.com/smog/issue9/featured_pokemon I swear this is the best analysis of Breloom EVER!! READ IT!!!

I have 3 different Breloom sets that I love.

1) "Classic SubPunch"

Adamant/Jolly @ Toxic Orb
40 HP/ 252 Atk/ 216 Speed (Jolly)
40 HP/ 216 Atk/ 252 Speed (Adamant)
~ Spore
~ Substitute
~ Seed Bomb
~ Focus Punch

Breloom is undoubtedly the best pokemon ever (at least before B/W, since I don't know for that yet) with the sub punch strategy. Spore, and Poison Heal are what make it soooo versitile and unique. Switch it on someone that you can scare out, spore the switch in (while toxic orb activates), and Sub on the next switch (unless they're screwed enought that they have to stay in). Wear down ANYTHING that comes at you, Poison heal pwns with this. I have stalled out a moltres with this before. All the PP in Focus Punch are welcomed.

These EV sets are custom and are done specifically to beat other breloom while keeping decent survivability (lives through scarf flygon outrage, etc.) and a powerful attack.

2) "Choice Scarf"

Jolly @ Choice Scarf
4 HP/ 252 Atk/ 252 Speed
~ Spore
~ Seed Bomb
~ Stone Edge
~ Superpower

This set set aims to amplify Brelooms relatively poor speed stat. Most people predict for a SubPunch set, so they send in people to take the sleep (with or without Lum Berry/etc). This Breloom hits the switch hard, then surprises them by hitting them first (usually for the KO) on the next turn. The speedy spore option is helpful when you want to neutralize a threat so that you can KO it later. Seed Bomb is often the best attacking option (despite what you might think) because Superpower/Stone Edge both give away the set. Superpower, then switch is often the best plan after they learn the set.

EVs are very straightforward on this one. Speed and power.

3) "SubPunch Variant"

Adamant @ Toxic Orb
12 HP/ 252 Atk/ 244 Speed
~ Spore
~ Stone Edge
~ Focus Punch
~ Substitute

This set is near the same as the first in terms of basic set up strategy. However, as seed bomb doesn't make for great coverage, Stone Edge is a good option to surprise the Flying types that think they have little to fear. Everything else is played the same. Stone Edge is also able to cover Breloom's Grass and Ice weaknesses a bit better.

EVs on this set opt for more speed then the ones in the above subpunch. Either set works, but I like more speed with this one. (Don'e ask why, I just like knowing that my speed is better. Unfortunately, these EVs are Smogon standard.
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PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:16 pm

breloom sucks man. hes a cheap azz pokemanz dat can be esily countered with good teams. Good pokes to have is even gengar, whos faster than breloom and wall his seed bomb. let someone sleep and switch in gengar on the sub. breloom wonte be stayin in there to long. physical defensive rotom-toaster can do this too. Oh and lets not forget his ultimate celebi and zapdos wallage. breloom sux.
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Monkey
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Number of posts : 1794
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Misc. Info : humor of the glory days:
[17:53:38] Shitface : monkey is a redhead too
[17:53:47] Shitface : and so is caiite
[17:53:50] Shitface : and so is tom
[17:54:19] MonkeyJR : Shitface i bald <---LOL!


PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:21 am

Garma wrote:
breloom sucks man. hes a cheap azz pokemanz dat can be esily countered with good teams. Good pokes to have is even gengar, whos faster than breloom and wall his seed bomb. let someone sleep and switch in gengar on the sub. breloom wonte be stayin in there to long. physical defensive rotom-toaster can do this too. Oh and lets not forget his ultimate celebi and zapdos wallage. breloom sux.

Stone Edge makes for better type coverage than Seed Bomb.

69.1% - 81.7% against a standard Gengar.
So if you get SR up it's 71.5% - 94.2% which means Gengar can't switch out. UNLESS Breloom gets min damage and no crit with a high hit crit ratio move.

51.2% - 60.6% to a Physically Bulky Zapdos.
84.7% - 100.3% to a Sweeper Zapdos.
With SR Physically Bulky Zapdos takes 76.2% - 85.6% so he can't come back in after min damage if you have SR up.

33.6% - 39.8% to the Physically Defensive Rotom-Heat(Gen. 4).
61.8% - 73% to the Sweeper Rotom-Heat(Gen. 4).
67.1% - 79.6% to the Physically Defensive Rotom-Heat(Gen. 5).
So aside from the Gen 4 252 HP, 252 Def., and Bold nature Rotom...it's a clean 2HKO. Due to the Fire Typeage in Gen. 5 it can't take a Stone Edge or Focus Punch anymore. Gen. 5 Rotom-Heat is also weaker to SR so it's all down to min-max damage but if you force it to switch out with SR, it's gone.

24.5% - 29% to a Physically Defensive Celebi.
Celebi is the one wall to Breloom you mentioned.

So if you run Stone Edge(which more and more are running now-a-days) your list of "Walls" has 2 that don't get 2HOK'd by Breloom...one of which does get 2HKO'd in Gen. 5. Not to mention the high crit hit ratio, SR(which is on 90% of the teams I face) ensures I can switch into a poke who can wall your counter and then force you to stay in and die or switch and only have it has a death fodder later. So aside from Celebi in Gen. 5 all your "walls" can do is break his Sub. Sleep Clause is really the only to counter to Breloom.

Monkey

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PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:00 pm

Champion Monkey wrote:


Stone Edge makes for better type coverage than Seed Bomb.

69.1% - 81.7% against a standard Gengar.
So if you get SR up it's 71.5% - 94.2% which means Gengar can't switch out. UNLESS Breloom gets min damage and no crit with a high hit crit ratio move.

51.2% - 60.6% to a Physically Bulky Zapdos.
84.7% - 100.3% to a Sweeper Zapdos.
With SR Physically Bulky Zapdos takes 76.2% - 85.6% so he can't come back in after min damage if you have SR up.

33.6% - 39.8% to the Physically Defensive Rotom-Heat(Gen. 4).
61.8% - 73% to the Sweeper Rotom-Heat(Gen. 4).
67.1% - 79.6% to the Physically Defensive Rotom-Heat(Gen. 5).
So aside from the Gen 4 252 HP, 252 Def., and Bold nature Rotom...it's a clean 2HKO. Due to the Fire Typeage in Gen. 5 it can't take a Stone Edge or Focus Punch anymore. Gen. 5 Rotom-Heat is also weaker to SR so it's all down to min-max damage but if you force it to switch out with SR, it's gone.

24.5% - 29% to a Physically Defensive Celebi.
Celebi is the one wall to Breloom you mentioned.

So if you run Stone Edge(which more and more are running now-a-days) your list of "Walls" has 2 that don't get 2HOK'd by Breloom...one of which does get 2HKO'd in Gen. 5. Not to mention the high crit hit ratio, SR(which is on 90% of the teams I face) ensures I can switch into a poke who can wall your counter and then force you to stay in and die or switch and only have it has a death fodder later. So aside from Celebi in Gen. 5 all your "walls" can do is break his Sub. Sleep Clause is really the only to counter to Breloom.

Monkey

lol? wtf stone edge instead of seed bomb wut u smoking fool? why wuld u switch out a stab seed bomb for stone edge? you say more coverage? LOL brah you just lost your only advantage against bulky waters + ground walls like hippow, donfan, and gliscor to extent, which is what breloom's specilty is for. keep the seed bomb.
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[17:53:38] Shitface : monkey is a redhead too
[17:53:47] Shitface : and so is caiite
[17:53:50] Shitface : and so is tom
[17:54:19] MonkeyJR : Shitface i bald <---LOL!


PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:04 pm

From years of experience with Breloom I can tell you for a fact that Stone Edge is the MUCH better option. Seed Bomb is fine, but Stone Edge does more damage all around. What Bulky Water do you want Seed Bomb for?

Lets go down the list of the top Defensive Waters:

1) Cloyster: Part Ice so Focus Punch is better.
2) Omastar: Weak to Fighting again.
3) Suicune: Max HP/Def take 46.5% - 55.4% from Seed Bomb and 43.8% - 51.5% from Focus Punch. A 2-3 hit KO reguardless.
4) Slowbro: The first Bulky Water where it makes a difference.
5) Kabutops: Weak to Fighting again.
6) Gorebyss/Huntail: 59.6% - 70.7% from Focus Punch and 65% - 76.4% from Seed Bomb...either is a 2HKO.
7) Blastoise: Again Focus Punch and Seed Bomb are a 2HKO.
After that the NFE Bulky Waters come into play so I'll stop where 1/7 your move makes a difference in the turns to KO.

As for the three walls you listed in the last post, lets break them down:
1) Hippowdon(Physical Wall Set): 44.3% - 52.4% from Focus Punch and 47.6% - 56.2% from Seed Bomb. If the Sub is up, however, most Hippos will Roar so you get the one hit you DON'T OHKO.
2) Donphan(Rapid Spin Set): 59.6% - 70.6% from Focus Punch and 64.1% - 75.5% from Seed Bomb so still a 2HKO.
3) Gliscor(standard Stallbreaker): 33.3% - 39.8% from Seed Bomb and 31.1% - 36.7% from Focus Punch. So after Leftovers a 4HKO for either move.
So Seed Bomb does you no more than Focus Punch does on the three walls you listed.
Not to mention the High-Crit-Ratio for Stone Edge. =)

To be 100% honest, if your the "Best" you should know these standard damage calcs when deciding between moves. You seem to either:
A) Talk about pokes you have rarely to face so don't know enough basic information to know how they function in battles.
B) Don't have the experience you claim to have to not know that the differences in damage done is meaningless.

I have done so many battles, wins and losses, to say how much a standard set will do to my pokes(give or take 10%) off the top of my head so I can tell you what moves are better for whom(I just like to do the calcs when helping others plan for their teams to prove the actual differences to others).

Next time you try to say a certain move is better for a certain pokemon...please prove your reasoning or I will be forced to prove you wrong for the third straight post here. As you can see above, out of the 7 "walls" to Breloom you listed, I have proved 5 of them aren't a "wall" and 1 of the remaining two that loses his walling Breloom abilities in Generation 5. So 1/7 is an actual "wall"(note every poke has it's weakness). Then the top 7 Physical Bulky Walls of the type you said my moveset couldn't do as much to your set as, did just as much as your set on 6/7 of the pokes. So in the end...your 2/14...not the best record for you.

Monkey

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PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:48 am

R you kiding me fool? all your calcs are correct give or take few but you're missing the point. your reasoning that focus punch can cover wutever seed bomb does relies that breloom is behind a sub -- and that's not always reliable. say swampert breaks your sub. yur pretty much gonna switch out without the seed bomb eh? you pretty much wasted your time with breloom out. If they dont carry an ice beam they'll roar you out -- either way you lose. or lets say take suicune breaks a sub. same idea. you gonna sub again while he keeps breaking it? or pound him with 2 seed bombs for a kill? in pokemon you cant rely on subs. you obviously dont battle enough to know that.

And also, you have some lame idea of "bulky waters". didnt even include vaporeon, milotic, SWAMPERT, or even starmie to extent. stop dancing around the obvious
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Misc. Info : humor of the glory days:
[17:53:38] Shitface : monkey is a redhead too
[17:53:47] Shitface : and so is caiite
[17:53:50] Shitface : and so is tom
[17:54:19] MonkeyJR : Shitface i bald <---LOL!


PostSubject: Re: Pokemon Of The Month, October 2010   Fri Oct 22, 2010 10:35 am

Offensive Suicune Outspeeds Breloom(and Seed Bomb doesn't OHKO) so Seed Bomb needs a specific set to me more efficient. Swampert users need to know that they are slower and NOT Ice Beam the Sub, but Roar the Sub due to Swapert's slow speed...so unless you're fighing a rare set without Roar the set makes no difference. Seed Bomb requires specific sets on Bulky Waters to be more effective on Breloom. The fact that Breloom can sleep the Bulky Waters, if you use it right, people predict Seed Bomb and switch out their Waters, which Stone Edge can catch them off guard because near-no people expect it.

Vaporeon and Milotic are types I'd Spore on...Milotic with Rest Talk is a nice option...but if you put something else to sleep and they just result in a stall war with Rest, Recover, and Wish. Breloom can come out of that the winner without the Sub...so all you get in 1 KO on a slow Water type which you could sleep to have your Sub on when he leaves the battle.
Starmie outspeeds with 0 Speed EVs and a Neutral Nature for Speed...which makes Seed Bomb 'unless' in your turms unless it's a Sweeper Set...but then who would send Starmie in?

Also think about this:
I send in Breloom to sleep whatever I send it in on. Then the turn I sub, most people will send in one of your first "counter". Is it gonna be a Bulky Water or a Flying/Poison/Ghost to resist Focus Punch/Seed Bomb? 75+% of battlers out there expect Seed Bomb making Stone Edge more efficient.

In the end, Seed Bomb v Stone Edge is purely based upon what situation you find yourself in. 70% - 30% of the time Stone Edge works to be more efficient from my experience, with my teams. 90% of the skilled players wouldn't leave a Bulky Water in on Breloom due to expecting Seed Bomb. It's all about who you know your foe has, who you use your Spore turn on, and what types your teams need more help with. I am more of a stalling so once I wait out the Sleep I got with Spore the rest of my team can set up T-Spikes or just use Toxic and stall out the Bulky Waters and such. I want to draw out Poison types with Breloom so I can Toxic stall all day...Focus Punch and Seed Bomb helps out my specific teams in a lesser way than something to take out the Poisons/Flyings/Ghost. If your team needs a way to deal with Bulky Waters then go Seed Bomb...but more people try to counter Seed Bomb and it'll throw you into a harder position to KO what they tend to use.

As I tried to say in my last post, Seed Bomb isn't a terrible option, it's just more predictable. I actually have multiple Brelooms and switch them up so if I fight the same people the don't know which moves I am running.

If you need Breloom to KO the Bulky Waters, I'd suggest Spore, SD, Seed Bomb, and Mach Punch/Facade. That set gets you an OHKO, I believe, any Bulky Water with SR up...if anything survives one it should only be like...5% or so. This set allows Breloom to come in late game, Spore, get +2 Attack, Seed Bomb Bulky Waters, and Mach Punch faster pokes who have taken SR, Spikes, and other damage earlier in the battle.

Monkey

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